Does Religion Make Black Folks Stupid?

Mister Johnson, THANK YOU. Short and sweet. I need to practice that.

You're right, hate was never inferred nor expressed. Homos*xuality is just one of those subjects where if you don't agree with it, you're labeled a hatemonger or a homophobe.

It's foolish really...and manipulative, if you ask me.

Blessings...

Mister Johnson,
Although inspired by E. Privates Blog, this posting is broader (I hope:). My terms Hate and Love are used in their normal context. Both are based on perception. Sometimes words that are seen as mild or debate can be viewed as hateful...prime example: YOU PEOPLE.

I do however apologize if anyone thinks, thought, or will think I attach the word to the discussion last night...

Dee,

This blog is not about homos*xuals. This about if about knowledge and understanding of our faith. Believe what you believe...I'm just asking you to read and know your religion!

P.S. E. Private must have really hit a nerve :o)

Thx E,

Like you (and everybody else) I joined think site to change perceptions about Blacks in America. And ya'll know as good as I do, that we have got some house cleaning to do if you are going to invite company in for dinner and CNN interviews.

No matter how painful and touchy we have to open these doors and clean out some of this junk. Or we have to agree that this is our junk and we're proud of it. In either case...I am happen to help clean...just show me the room:)

Mister Johnson,
But what about Black Folks? Surely I haven't met or conversed with all Black Folks, but from my vantage point we seem to be overly accepting of self-certified religious leaders. As well, we quote religious doctrine without understand context or whole book(s)..A LOT!

And the folks I've met, talked to, lived with...weren't extremist. These were everyday folks!

True dat E...true dat!

Dr. Glover, with all due respect, I do read and what's more, I actually STUDY. Being in ministry requires me to take what I do and say very seriously and when discussing the Word (especially) to have my heart and head on straight.

Even though this blog is not about homs*xuality, you DID make mention of E Private's blog about the subject and a specific response from someone in your email (I guess) talking about the very subject. You started there and used someone's response (agreeable one) to do the gut check. So, at it's face value, it's not about homos*xuality, but in depth, the very premise of you make about reading the Word, etc., came out of your disagreeing stance with those of us who believe that homos*xuality is wrong.

And Mister Johnson is right. It has become quite divisive in nature. It's shameful really. Why, Dr. Glover, does believing it to be wrong equal either misinterpretation of scripture or hate and/or homophobia anyway??????????????????

Can ANYONE throwing out those terms answer THAT question, please?

Blessings...

E Private, you said:

"Indeed. But while most of us were able to engage amically, there were a few, who showed a bit of ferocity on the subject, thereby exposing their extremities."

You're right. You were one of those people...for sure.

Blessings...

Dr. Glover, you said, "P.S. E. Private must have really hit a nerve :o) "

I agree. As did you. It's hard to hear people take scripture and beat it up with propaganda and personal feelings. Leaning to one's OWN understanding is dangerous. And the theo-illogical nature of it all has literally turned my stomach. It always hits a nerve (and rightly) when I see the Word not only taken out of context, but misinterpreted and mishandled altogether. And the saddest part is that if I were someone who didn't no better...who didn't know God...who didn't try my best to build an intimate one on one relationship with Him...who didn't seek the truth for myself...who didn't actually STUDY and didn't prooftext or use eisegesis to make MY point fit...I would have ACTUALLY BELIEVED IT.

I'm praying steadfastly. I am. It's hard to see the Word run into the ground. And frankly, it hurts that most of us DO know better, but will go kicking and screaming about some subjects (such as this one) to not DO better.

I don't nearly know everything, but what I DO know, I don't hesitate to share.

Blessings...

I actually have to step out of this conversation now. I'm tempted to handle it carnally and that wouldn't be right and God wouldn't get the glory. In others words, I'm tempted to have a fleshly response, and the wisdom of God is advising that I bow out now before this does get (more) personal. Then, it would cease to be about HIM.

Respectfully refusing to engage in anymore banter and participate in or incite an unnecessarily disrespectful and unGodly argument...

Blessings...

E Private, I wasn't being sarcastic. I was totally serious. You were one of those very people you describe (in my opinion). And don't get too mad. LOL. It's just an opinion. Accept it or reject it. ;-)

And when all else fails (and it has...miserably), you WOULD try to attack my Christianity. Just the same as calling people who disagree with homos*xuality hatemongers and homphobes. I'd respond to that, but what's the point??????????? You'd have to know me to know better. And you don't so I expect that you'd be ignorant. (And ignorant is not a bad word. It just means you're not "in the know").

It's been real fun conversing with you. ...Really fun. Let's do this again sometime.

Again...

Blessings...

EP, that previous response was a fleshly one. I'll have to talk to God about it. He's still working with me on that part of myself that welcomes a good fight.

See? I'm not sinless and don't pretend to me. But Lord, help me to win the battle before it becomes a war and I step in it. I'm gonna learn that God doesn't need my help to do God. He does just fine on His own.

"Plant the seeds," I'm telling myself again. "...and then WALK *AWAY*." LOL at my own self. I feel like Laurence Fishburn's character in Boyz n Da Hood when he was telling Tre, "You gone learn....oh yeah...you GONE learn." LOL.

Blessings...

Okay...its looks like folks have stopped throwing bibles at each other...at least for now:)

How do we as a people get to a point where we can have meaningful discussions on tough questions without using and/or losing our religion? Most important, as seen in this forum, if "we" are not experts on "all" of God's word and/or we can allow the flesh to overpower God's word...why are we using scripture to answer our questions?

If you don't like gays because you believe in reproduction and they can't reproduce...I can respect that. I may have some other questions...but that is a logical, well conceived argument. Hitting me in the head with a bible is not a logical response.

What if I don't believe in your flavor of religion? What if Sunday or Church is not sacred to me? Are you the expert to shut down me for my incorrectness? Do you know your book’(s) intent, context, version, author, MEANING well enough to hide behind it.

If the answer is NO…you need to check yourself

Dr. Glover, you said:

"Most important, as seen in this forum, if "we" are not experts on "all" of God's word and/or we can allow the flesh to overpower God's word...why are we using scripture to answer our questions? "

Because none of us is PERFECT and anyone under the illusion that he is needs to check HIMSELF. Lack of perfection doesn't equal lack of truth, as you know, because you, TOO, threw some scripture out there.

And studying the Word and being able to communicate it effectively is "hiding behind it"? Amazing...just amazing. You learn something new every day. And I'll take another point from you, Dr. Glover...

LMBAO !!!! :-)

Blessings...

How can one have Evil with out Good? How can one be ignorant without being Enlightened? Religion is to me man's attempt to explain the unexplainable. Science is the study of the unexplainable where answers are derived from study. We have a Doctor posting on religion which is almost contradictorary to itself. One the one hand we have a scientist then on the other we have someone that was more than likely raised in the church trying to explain away what he grew up believing. E. Private is a genius. Dee is full of compassion Mr J is articulate and Rod E is shouting wake-up (ala L. Fishburne in Skool Days)...

If 5 or 6 voices of over 6billion are at odds on whether a system or morality makes on stupid how will the 8000 or so member of BIA think? I've traveled the world and seen true works of evil, poverty, horror and resounding faith in what is NOT SEEN... and once you see that why would I call any one stupid for having hope to believe in something not seen? By my profile all of you can see I seek Light and truth be told none of us have a clue on what real or fabricated.

Dee and Greg,

I post questions to make us (me too) think. And I always sit back and LMBAO:)

We are a diverse people with diverse views...I pray that we can air our views in a many that allows us to laugh and break bread at the end. In any of my Blogs, we don't have to agree...but we do have to think!

Oh yeah and as a social scientist I am often torn between science and faith...therefore I allow truth to be the deciding factor in all (well mostly all:) things I do!

Doc,

I agree i laugh when i type my responses because I find what I'm not saying even funnier than what I do say. Folks that have never seen a lot of things tend to hold on to the narrow view of life they do know. So to pick on the Church just may get you cut....LOL

It's pointless sometimes, to try to have a constructive conversation if anything spiritual comes to the table because then believers, like myself, have to see words like, "Can not you all see or is it the veil that has been placed over your hearts and minds? Religion makes all people stupid not just Blacks! " or "How I wish, we would not point our fingers and condemn our brothers and sisters to hell as if we are God ourselves! Leave the judgement to God is all I say." ...as if what we've said is judgment or condemnation AT ALL.

But how can I expect any different? I'm peculiar and proud of it. Sometimes it gets a little comfortable, but God does what He does on purpose, in purpose and for purpose. ROTF...

Dr. Glover, we do agree on one thing though:

"...we can air our views in a many that allows us to laugh and break bread at the end."

Come out friends? Definitely a GOOD PLAN!!! Hugs...

Blessings...

I'm glad this blog was posted. Recently I have been learning about Kemet (Egypt) and the religious practices. During my research I've learned about Serapis and Aryon, and the Nicean Creed. All these things have made me question my religious beliefs. Last year I saw a documentary called The Zeigiest Movie. So then to learn about Kemet and all the things that white people have done to our people and how they have trying so hard to hide the truth about our history made me more curious and hungry for knowledge that's why I've been choosing the topics I have been discussing on my radio show. So here's my question, did white people mess us up spiritually, and is Jesus real? Why aren't there any historical records or pictures of him? The same King James bible that black people read came from the same king james that sent Willie Lynch to America, thus came the term lynching, and the speech that has kept our minds in slavery for hundreds of years. Are Christians worshiping a Jesus that never exsisted? Help me out please because this too much to handle.

Greg,

Having spend 20 years in the Air Force and lived on most continents...I've seen folks do the damndest stuff in the name of GOD.

Sadly, when you look at the same verse these folks used to do these horrible things...the text meant something else when it was written. In some cases the author warns folks not to take the verse(s) out of context.

But thousands of years later the Bosnians hated the Serbs... over 2000 year old words, the Turks hate the Kurds...over 2000 year old words, the Jews hate the Palestinians....over 3000 year old words...the list goes on and on.

I just want my people to think, read, and know what we are talking about before we fall into the trap! The lord works in mysterious ways...and so does the DEVIL!

I’m begging my people to think…which one (GOD or satan) would want you to hate another one of GOD's creations?

Che, I believe that Jesus is ABSOLUTELY real. And "that King James Bible" you refer to isn't "black folks' Bible..." It's A Bible...a version, which is a translation from Hebrew and Greek to English. Here's a link talking about how the translation(s) came about and why they were necessary: http://www.bible.ca/b-many-versions.htm

I'm not sure about the other parts you posted. I've answered what I can answer though. ...hope it helps.

Blessings...

Dr. Glover, ;-) ...

God ain't no mystery.

Blessings...

Che,

All mankind and all it's knowledge originated in AFRICA!!!!! The Garde of Eden was in Africa...Tubal Cain the first worker of Metal was African... the Cescendents of Noah that created the Arts and Sciences were African!!! So of course greeks, romans, araians are going to try and lighten up the creators of our past instead of given the ORIGINATORS the credit. In genesis Yahweh made Adam out of the dust of the Earth... Now tell me where lies any "dust" that when water is added to it comes ot WHITE? Religion does not make men ignorant, but becoming complacent just might keep that man from learning Christian beliefs are millions of years older than the Jesus story.... Jesus is real... his time line is the fabrication....

Thank you Mrs. Gray I am looking at that link right now

Che Love,

Back during the time of Christ (or shortly after), there as an impartial guy named Josephus. He was the historian of his day and he documented something that lets us know that a guy named Jesus did exist. Sadly, his account will definitely give you more questions than answers.

You see Josephus documented the death of Jesus’ brother James (yep the same guy that wrote the book of James in the new testament...ie....the warnings about the incorrect teachings of Peter and Paul…e.g….you can’t have deeds without works).

http://www.religiousstudies.uncc.edu/jdtab...

Dr... you cant bring up James, Jesus brother the real priest in the Jewish threefold leadership structure.... You have Jesus (The King) You have James (The Priest) and God the bridge between the two... John the Baptist was one of the pillars until his death and Jesus the radical had to jump the revolution off to get the Romans out of his country... so he imbodied bith roles King and Priest.... Um did not Jesus tell his disciples to seek out his BROTHER James after his death? Doc what about Barabus some say that he was really James and the Jews choose their Preist over their King.... Come on religion doesnt make black folks stupid.... ignorant maybe... but stupid nah....

Greg,

That's too much:) I'm not trying to get too deep on this Blog...everybody ain't ready for everything!

I just want use to know our books BEFORE we try to use them as weapons. That has been done to us, against us...and for us. We must rise above our differences and realize that we can still laugh and play together..even when we don't agree....cause weez family ya'll!

E... Depends on the source of the info as to who was who back in the day. Constantine wanted a combined empior so he grab a little of this lets call if what we cllit now, Easter and Chritmas from the pagans... the spring feast ooops passover... from the druids... and with enough pensmanship... and a few councils we have Christanity.... Again the source of the information is key... I gre up in Ohio and did you know the underground railroad ran right thru that state? Funny I didnt know that because my Ohio approved history books didnt cover it! The Source... Jesus was a radical... James who was killed by one of the dicsiples was a priest... and Judas was asked to turn Jesus in.... All in all we all will argue this point into etternity, but consider the source... oh the Egyptian and Ethopian bibles has books in it that our King james doesnt mention, ant both of them are considerably older than the KJV? I wonder if they held Africans in Higher esteem then the Causcasion edition....

The impartial historian of the day, begs James as the brother of Jesus. This fact is used by most scholars to support Jesus' existence. Although we'd like to, we can't have it both ways...either James is the bother and Jesus existed...or he is not and there is no evidence of Jesus?

Greg,
I'm not sure where you get you info...but you have some of the most up-to-date science facts that we have. There is evidence that during the period that Jesus lived radicals were in fact attempting to get the non-Jews out. Sadly, our biblical account of Jesus' death shows that the very people he sought to defend had him put to dead. And his crime was not a Roman crime...his crime was failure to prove his bloodline to Abraham…ie…meet prophecy requirements. Thereby, False King (prophet) of the Jews was his crime and sentence.
http://www.simpletoremember.com/vitals/jew...

Ya'll see this is exactly why I posted this Blog. If we have these many differences about the most important thing in our life...why are we using this to settle our differences. You see it as green...I see it as red. We have to find other less confrontational means to work through tough Black folk issues.

Dr,

I read!

E,

Spot on! The issue for Jesus was his ability to be the Messiah; match the prophecy of his coming. The Jews believed (still believe) that he had to have a direct bloodline to David (back to Abraham) to meet GOD's covenant ("I shall make you a great nation"). When you get through all the who be got whoms for Jesus...it stops at Joseph...and it is widely held that Joseph was not Jesus' father: Matthew 1:16.

Again...spot on!

The devil is alive. There is nothing wrong with learning more about the Bible and other religions. The Bible actually encourages it. Heck, the book of Proverbs speaks over and over about the goodness of knowledge. How can you ever spot the enemy if you don't know him/it first?

I don't understand why people debate the Bible/Scripture. You either believe in it or you don't. There is one sure thing in this life and that is we all will die. No one will live forever. Those who follow the teachings of the LORD know exactly where they are going. Those who don't, don't but should. The thing about Hell is, you don't have to believe in it to burn in its fires for eternity. We all have to make that decision. Heaven or not. There is no debate necessary.

Ebony,

Way to enter a room and just start kicking folks in the eye;)

What if I never heard about your flavor of faith in my corner of the world? Am I doomed cause we don't have TV?

Ebony.

Came in like the young Mike Tyson.... But valid point I aint got no TV either, so not all hears what thus sayeth the Lord...

For those who were wondering what I was talking about yesterday when I mentioned Serapis check out this website:
http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/se...

People always say believe in your heart. The heart is just an organ, it cannot think, all it does it pump blood through our bodies. Its our minds we must use not our hearts. Don't get me wrong I do believe in God, even the bible tells us to seek and we shall find. I cannot go on the bible alone. I have to research, i have to study, we're supposed to study in order to grow. How do we know that Jesus and Serpais are 2 different people? How will we ever know the truth if we don't search for it? Religion is so much information and there is so much history behind it. I do wonder though, if Christianity is not the true religion of black people, should we still practice it?

Brother Rod,

I feel your pain. Folks like to be experts on religion without the training, time and/or education needed to be the expert!

Sadly, with religion, we become overnight experts and teach our brand of goodness to others. As well, since we have no concept that a whole world exists (not just our singular churches views) we think everything is based on what is or is not in our specific religious book/teachings.

Don't get me wrong, I love for my people to have strong views on an issue. I love more...for them to have defendable, well thought out positions that are based on something more than feelings. Please don't forget that "FEELINGS BROUGHT SLAVES TO THE NEW WORLD!"

We must use logic going forward...

Corey, your description of the heart was a good one. I agree whole-heartedly.

Religion- The Direction of The Creator of the Heavens and the Earth. No that does not make anyone stupid.

Europeans call some descendants of Adam and Eve; black and some red and some yellow and some white-----------Thats stupid.

Europeans, though have a religion or way of life that they call white supremacy and yes any who follow that religion are stupid black folks, red folks, yellow folks and white folks.

First a lil side note.....I did not misspell my name. It is spelled Ebone'(pronounced Eb-bow-nay). It is not Ebony. Just wanted to get that straight.

Second, why do you need a television to read the Bible and know the LORD? It's not about my flavor of faith. It's quite simple, read the Bible,follow HIS words. You may not like what I have to say but I'm right. You either believe or you don't. You either go to Heaven or Hell. The choice is up to you.

Thank you yet once again Dr. Glover, hopefully your comment,just now, and this blog will go a long way in showing/proving we are in need of reeducation/trying to use basic logical conclusions...like...education-centered 'wisdom' is the magic bullet needed to save mankind itself from it self.

Again my thanks and respect for/to you Dr.

Dr. Glover there is a weekly program on the science channel called Naked Archaeology where you can find a lot of scientific discoverys related to this subject on/about the Bible in an "objective' manner.And, away from main stream media's bible conclusions/religious superiority subjective beliefs-conclusions,etc. There is a lot of discussion among Bible education experts and theology professors from major colleges.... dialoging on the Bible from digs, recorded history. They cover the times(proven) periods when and where the different parts of the Bible were written and how these recording related to the social order-conditions at that time...On my cable I can get many of these educational channels....

Dr. Glover...Gregory says he "reads",lets try 'word of mouth' , life experiences of ups and downs educate you:then see If it makes sense to you in the first placebefore believing you have been educated. Wisdom should come from knowledge!!!!.

Just never use the conclusions of others there by allowing your fear of offending others , going to hell or lack of self-esteem block our your OWN ability to do your own thinking....Make your own choices if you have to learn the language of smoke signals, drums, sign language or trusting your elder's verbal history being passed down for /from countless generations....

And one of the ironies of something I saw was tracing King David ,archaeologic, and how he 'aquired his lovers" - legal wive:(of which you know whom Ispeak of) King David had an obsession with Iranian women... now fast forward to Israel and Iran today?????

Be very careful Gregory as you are actually agreeing with the Buddhist concept of:balance, cause and effect, being responsible for you own actions by placing you in full charge of your own daily life....No, all Buddhism do not have Buddha idols. They have a variety of social beliefs. religious beliefs, spiritual individuals as do Christian religions.

"Amen brother Gregory and may we now try to begin to at least start to understand why our African history-culture did not start in American slavery nor the Civil Rights movement...truth brother truth "the God's truth"!!!!!!!!!!!!

...sorry Gregory, I left out of my comment to you to smile as I did while Iwas fully agreeing with your comment about what makes you laugh...

"common" sense tell me that some where there is a message critique of EP?????????? Please my people it this is true please, I beg US to let us rise beyond this distructive behavior to black Unity;and leave this to the main stream media. In the name of all that is Holy.....and humaine....